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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited by Moderator)
OK . . . so today was the the day. My 5-yr service plan has ended. The 140 is on 25000 miles and due an oil and filter change. I thought long and hard but decided to do it myself. The plan was simple. . . .

Drain the oil hot, leave the car for 4-6 hours to cool off and then remove the filter. I had two reasons in mind:
  1. Perhaps the plastic body of the oil filters is softer when hot and therefore more prone to shear and
  2. By leaving the car to drain, I supposed the filter housing might also drain down over time so that if I was unlucky enough for the filter to shear, then there wouldn't be a sudden exodus of oil and detritis into the engine such that I could simply clean out the housing and that would be sufficeint.

In the end, I needn't have worried - the filter came out intact. Before I go further . . . some interesting stats.
  • Oil drain down produced exactly 6180 ml of oil - clearly this will vary from car to car dependent upon how "full" the sump is at the time
  • Removing the filter produced a further 205ml of oil meaning that the oil in the filter housing is vacuum locked and won't get released until the top is removed from the housing. This blew my theory apart but hey ho . . .
  • Please bear in mind, my car has only ever been serviced by Listers BMW and yet I almost fell at the first hurdle when I couldn't remove the cover flap in order to gain access to the sump plug - this is held in place by a plastic clip which is rotated using a flat-head screw driver but the numpties had burred the head over so badly that it was almost impossible to turn. I got it off eventually after much swearing and cursing . . . . have ordered a replacement cover clip £5.60 + VAT.

I removed the engine cover and cleaned around the oil filler cap but then noticed that the two facia covers weren't fixed down and were completely loose - the passenger side cover appears to provide access to the ABS modulator and is held in place by three 10mm plastic 1/4 turn nuts. The driver's side cover includes a red hinged flap for access to the positive battery terminal and removal of the cover affords access to the brake reservoir and again, is held in place with three plastic clips which are located by 1/4 turn 10mm plastic nuts.

I removed both covers and inspected them. OK . . some muppet at Listers hadn't realised they were 1/4 turn to release and had simply put a socket on each of them in turn and rotated them around and around and in so doing, had mangled them. Thnkfully, I was able to tease each back into the correct position and despite the damage, I have them back working again as per but jeez guys . . . . . who do the dealers employ in their workshops these days?? I am now feeling more than pleased I took on this job and will never, never put my car in for work again unless it's for something well beyond my remit. It might be the "ultimate driving machine" which would be fine if the dealers employed the "ultimate" techs . . they don't!! . Anyway . . . I digress

I duly replaced the sump plug and mega-lubed (Take note Johnny Depp) the O-rings on the new filter before filling with 6.5 litres of Fuchs Titan GT1 Flex 5 0W-20 (BMW LL 17FE+ approved)

Now then . . . the point of this story

The filter I removed was part number 8584473-03 manufactured on 20th Jan 2020 and I replaced it with the new filter, part number BMW 7826800-01 manufactured on 19th Feb 2022.
My intention had been to remove the paper element and then use a digital torque adapter to test how much torque could be applied to the frame of the filter before it sheared. I was hoping to do this on both old and new filters and at ambient and again at 80-90 celcius. My intention was simply to find out if there was any merit in allowing the filters to cool before changing them and likewise, to investigate if the later incarnations of filters are indeed any stronger and an improvement on the originals. Well peeps . . . the plan came to nothing and I think most of you are going to be gob-smacked when you find out why. . . .again see following photos.

I duly set about carving into the paper element with my trusty Stanley knife and gently removed the element in order to reveal the plastic frame of the filter body but . . . before I could finish, the top fell off the filter body!!! . . . yup, you did read that correctly - it literally fell off and without any force being applied.

Undaunted, I set about removing the remaining paper element before this time . . .the bottom of the filter body simply fell off in my hands. OK . . . so I washed the whole thing in petrol, dried it off and examined it closely under magnification (more than shown in the photos) and the problem with these filters is immediately apparent.

OK . . . so, when these things are made, there are 4 components for assembly - a filter base, a filter top, a central filter tube and a paper element. Each end of the filter tube is keyed and has two raised edges, each of about 1/4 the circumference of the tube. These "keys" fit into a corresponding recess in both the filter base and filter top and they are simply located and glued in place. So . . . junior takes the filter base and carefully locates and glues the filter element into the base. He then applies a little glue to the filter tube and slides it down inside the element, rotates it whilst pushing the two together until he feels the keys locate into position and the tube will no longer rotate. He now applies a little glue to the filter top and the exposed top of the tube, before gluing both the exposed end of the element into the top and ensuring the keys line up.

OK . . so when these things are removed by undoing the filter cap, the body of the filter is rotated because the filter top is captive in the cap. The force applied to the filter in turning it is applied from the top of the filter down through the central plastic tube via the "keys" and likewise to the bottom. Now bear in mind, these keys are only about 0.3mm in depth, if that. Imagine a scenario where the two O-rings at the filter base are gripping fairly tenaciously - as the cap is rotated to remove it, the filter is actually being "stretched" slightly as it is drawn up the housing. Gluing two pieces of plastic is a p*ss poor piece of design and is always going to break when exposed to any kind of force and of course, the keys are so shallow that the turning force and stretching force combined are simply serving to dislocate the keys. As soon as this happens, the entire turning force or torque applied to the housing cap simply serves to shear the paper element as it is no longer being borne by the plastic filter body. The rest is history . . . we know what happens!!!!

Now, bear in mind, the filter below is a gen 3, manufactured in 2020 and so gawd only knows how poor the first two versions were - I would have no confidence in this filter remaining intact quite frankly . . . I just got lucky, very bloody lucky!!!! In two years/20000 miles, I will take a look at the design of the filter I have just installed to see if it has been improved - maybe it has . . maybe not!!? Frankly, I'm not expecting much as this is now Gen 4!!!!! Meanwhile, now that we know why these things are failing . . . what can home DIY oil/filter changers do to prevent filter carnage???

Well . .I'm open to suggestions but here's one for starters.

Clearly it is important to ensure that the bottom two O-rings release at the get go and don't grip so hard that as the cap is undone, the filter is being stretched such that the filter base dislocates from the central tube. So . . .my plan on next change will be to release the cap about 1/16th of a turn before nipping it back up again. Then 1/8th of a turn before again nipping it up. Finally, release the cap by 1/4 turn before tightening back and then repeating the 1/4 turn sequence before finally and slowly undoing and removing the filter cap.

The purpose of this is to break the bonds between the O-rings and their sealing faces but to do so progressively without stretching the filter excessively and allowing the keys to dislocate from between the filter tube and filter base. Once the O-rings are loose and "lubed", the whole assembly should come out without issue.

The basic problem with this design is the shallow depth of the keys between the filter tube and filter base being insufficient to remain locked together when exposed to force in shear and when simultaneously under tension . . .the latter being resisted only by a thin smear of glue and the tensile strain in the paper element helping to keep the keys in situ. The keys simply need to be far deeper, stronger or even more obvious . . interlocked so that they can't simply fall apart.
This is an odious piece of kindergarten design by BMW . . .

The first picture below shows the filter tube with the two raised "keys" from 7-10 and 2-4 as per a "clock face".

Corded phone White Automotive tire Telephone Gadget


The second photo shows the filter base and the key recess is quite clear to see from 7-10 in this photo. The key on the opposite side is less evident. The jagged edge on the opposite side is the remnants of the glue used to stick the tube to the filter base. You would imagine that BMW would use some kind of solvent-based glue but it is either used very sparingly or its solvent properties are very weak because there is no evidence of fusing/melting of the contact faces of the keys which remain, to all intents and purposes, virgin plastic.

Brown Eyelash Wood Iris Automotive tire


The third photo shows the rough inner edge all the way around the inside circumference of the filter base. This appearance would lead some to believe the base has "sheared" off . . . it hasn't. The tube and base are indeed two separate components which are glued together; The rough edge is nothing more than the contact face of the adhesive which has broken in shear. I cannot stress too strongly . . when the paper element was removed from my filter, the plastic frame literally fell apart in my hands and I used very little force in removing the element. Unless BMW have addressed this issue with the latest filter design . . this problem is here to stay peeps and so take heed!!!

Computer keyboard Peripheral Food Input device Ingredient
 

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Great work, much appreciated. That explains a lot.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 · (Edited)
I’ve had a couple more thoughts on this. . . .
For the sake of a £20 investment, I may buy a new filter and tear it apart to compare the design.
From the above, it is clear the mechanical integrity of the filter is maintained largely by the paper element itself being “resistant” to stretch such that the keys in the filter top and base remain seated.
It is quite possible that earlier gen 1 to gen 3 mutations of this hideous device used the same design but perhaps different element material, either stronger or perhaps more resistant to stretch??
If I pull one apart we will know straight away.
Another thought . . . . .
At some point I will call in to my local friendly Toyota dealership and speak to the techs. They must be having the same problem but there is nothing out there on Supra filter failures!!? 🙄
Have Toyota addressed the issue and are they using a different filter? I suspect not - I expect to find they’re using the same piece of plastic excrement assembled in Tunisia but hey, you never know. If they’re using a better filter then I know where my future B58 filters will be coming from!!!
I will take my old filter frame to show them!! I may even take it in to Listers but will probably be met with a disinterested tirade of raspberry blowing from a tech wielding a 10mm electric wrench stripping out some poor unfortunate’s fascia panels 😡😡😡
 

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A most detailed appraisal. Does it amount simply to poor quality filters and failure to lubricate the filter O ring? I have changed oil and filters on my 240i 3 times, replacing with Mann filters, (German made), without issue.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Well, mine is OEM - it would be interesting to dissect one or two different brands and see if there are any significant differences in construction.
of course, one or other of these big brand names will be the OEM manufacturer to BMW’s spec anyway and is quite likely it could be Mann or Mahle.
To answer your question - clearly the OEM design is too fragile - that goes without saying.
I suspect this borderline design means that it’s a lottery as to whether or not you will get away with it every time you change a filter.
On the off chance that lubing the O-rings “might” make a difference, I removed mine fully, lubed the recess and each O-ring fully before reinserting into their grooves but now I know how these things are made, I will be sweating buckets at next oil change!!
On this same subject, you have to wonder if lubing the O-rings is more convention and protocol than anything else because after 20000 miles or two years submerged in 100 degree oil, it’s hard to think that oil won’t have crept into every conceivable interface??
Still, I will pursue this further - if we can find a brand of filter which is manufactured differently and resistant to this type of failure, we would have to be nuts not to use it. The BMW own brand filter ain’t it as far as I can tell!
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
I’ve had another thought re failures. . . .
it’s very likely that some filters are assembled but without due care to ensure the keys are correctly located.
In this case, the filter will start to self-destruct on installation as the paper element will be subject to disintegrating right from the outset.
When installing a new filter, One very simple measure would be to grasp the new filter at each end and firmly twist the opposing ends - if it’s solid, the keys are located, if it shows signs of twisting, the keys aren’t located, bin it and buy another safe in the knowledge you just saved yourself a whole load of grief!!!
 

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Nice work. Pretty good reason not to buy an OEM filter. Sounds like Mahle, Mann, HifloFiltro, Bosch, etc could not be any worse than OEM.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Nice work. Pretty good reason not to buy an OEM filter. Sounds like Mahle, Mann, HifloFiltro, Bosch, etc could not be any worse than OEM.
Except one or other of these will be from the OEM manufacturer but . . . . .which??!!
I'm going to make a video of this and post to YouTube for a wider Audience. Will stick a link in this thread when I've done it as it will make understanding potentially easier
 

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Normally people are really fussy about using OEM filters and there has been worry about warranty if another filter has been used but with this problem it might be good to use another make - Mahle in particular I always try and use these where possible.

They are available from Euro car parts so could be worth a purchase to have a look at how they are constructed.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Hi All . . . for those interested, I have made and posted a youtube video which quite nicely demonstrates and discusses this issue.
Will hopefully find out a little more by speaking toToyota dealer as next port of call

 

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Good video Javaman

I have ordered the Mann fiter from ECP. It was £17 so planning to examine it without destroying it if possible but I think it might only be possible to see how its put together with the paper removed like you did Javaman.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Good video Javaman

I have ordered the Mann fiter from ECP. It was £17 so planning to examine it without destroying it if possible but I think it might only be possible to see how its put together with the paper removed like you did Javaman.
Hi mate . . . perhaps watch this video and save yourself the trouble. It would seem that Mann are owned by a company called Wix and guess where their filters are made . . . . Tunisia!!! It would seem that Mann are the OEM manufacturer for BMW and so the part will almost certainly be one and the same.
It might be worth looking at a Bosch filter or Mahle if available. I won't do anything more on this until I've spoken to Toyota
 

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The spare 240i Mann filter I have says made in Germany, (aren't Wix owned by Mann+Hummel?). But maybe the specification is more important than who or where it is put together. My recently hired JCB excavator was assembled in the UK from parts made in India, (it is not the best excavator, however). My John Deere mower was assembled in USA from parts made - who knows where?
My main defence against the 2 series oil filter problem is to give each filter a firm twist by hand test, oil the O rings and hope for the best. The original filter was stiffer than the Knecht filter I replaced it with, but both came out without any problem. Since then German made Mann filters have also been OK.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
The spare 240i Mann filter I have says made in Germany, (aren't Wix owned by Mann+Hummel?). But maybe the specification is more important than who or where it is put together. My recently hired JCB excavator was assembled in the UK from parts made in India, (it is not the best excavator, however). My John Deere mower was assembled in USA from parts made - who knows where?
My main defence against the 2 series oil filter problem is to give each filter a firm twist by hand test, oil the O rings and hope for the best. The original filter was stiffer than the Knecht filter I replaced it with, but both came out without any problem. Since then German made Mann filters have also been OK.
Hi there . . .I was basing my comment on this video I found
MANN vs WIX oil filters for B58 engine - BMW 540i #Shorts - YouTube
Perhaps Mann have more than one factory making these filters? That said, I doubt there is more than one factory in Tunisia producing them and so the BMW item being made in Tunisia, does rather suggest that Mann is their supplier. Either way and as you suggest, we need a reliable, robust filter regardless where it's made.
I have sent a link to my video to BMW Technical - I'm sure they will ignore it but you never know :lol2:
 

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Excellent video! I've been servicing my M240i myself for the past 5 years and I've used a variety of oil filters. The OEM oil filter assembly is made by UFI, and for a couple of years BMW used only UFI filters (no aftermarkets filters were available either).


Since Mann started to sell the filters in 2020 I've used only those and so far not had any issue...touch wood! I do change my oil every 6-7k miles, so my filter is never that old.

James
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Interesting replies.
Now we know where the design fault lies, clearly what we need is for these different filters to be pulled apart after an oil change and compared.
I did some reading on UFI filters and it seems some of theirs are made in China.
I suspect this issue revolves around branding. Certain brands will simply purchase a generic product and then brand it with their own name, whereas other “brands” will clearly manufacture the end product.
One obvious example is BMW themselves, who it would appear are using UFI. Indeed, do UFI manufacture all their own filters or outsource some products as well? For example, Gedore make fantastic socket sets and tools in Germany but they also rebrand Chinese generics for their cheaper ranges of Gedore Red.
One thing we do know is that the BMW item is made in Tunisia. We also know that some Mann filters are made in Germany, others in Tunisia, as are Wix . . . surely these items are all coming from the same Tunisian factory?
I went on a car parts website yesterday and they are offering about 20 different brands of oil filter for the B58, starting at around £5.00, in addition to the better known UFI, Wix, Mann, Mahle and Bosch. You can bet that most of the cheapo jobs will be churned out by the same Chinese factory which is offering branding.
Opie oils are offering a Mahle filter for the B58 - I will buy one, pull it apart and post on this thread . . . . let’s see what happens.
First thing I will check is the exact dimensions and intricate design because of course, a rebranded item will be identical to OEM in all but the laser-etched branding details. Watch this space. . . .
 

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Opie oils are offering a Mahle filter for the B58 - I will buy one, pull it apart and post on this thread . . . . let’s see what happens.
You do the Mahle and I'll do the Mann.

I know what you mean but location probably doesn't have anything to with it. My apple watch and phone was put together in China. If they can put them together I'm sure they can manage to assemble a few bits of plastic.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
You do the Mahle and I'll do the Mann.

I know what you mean but location probably doesn't have anything to with it. My apple watch and phone was put together in China. If they can put them together I'm sure they can manage to assemble a few bits of plastic.
You've got a deal. I'll order a Mahle later today.
For sure, geography has nothing to do with it - more a question of regulatory and quality control. Many branded products are produced in China and to a high standard but it's the portfolio of unregulated, generic rip-offs which result in the reputation for questionable quality. I can't see many 140 owners installing a £5.00 filter from an unknown brand but hey . . . couldn't be much worse that OEM in this case!!!
Mahle vs Mann . . . game on. I will post results on here but also make a video so that folks can see the thing being dismantled.
Thanks for offering to help
 
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