Git-r's road/track progress M135i

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git-r2
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Re: Git-r's road/track progress M135i

Post by git-r2 » Sun Apr 22, 2018 10:54 am

bentaylor wrote:
Sat Apr 21, 2018 2:58 pm
Just on the brake fluid point.

Just because a brake fluid is rated as DOT 5.1 does NOT make it a good fluid, and especially does not make it a god fluid for on track. FWIW most race fluids with high boiling points are DOT 4....

which fluid did you use as I am struggling to find a BMW fluid that is DOT 5.1 rated?

The OE BMW fluid is DOT 4 and has a dry boiling point (no water contamination) of 230degc and a wet boiling point (water contamination) of 155degc.

I use ATE type200 (used to be called super blue or super gold) as its £15 a litre from Euro car parts, DOT 4 with boiling points of 280degc(dry) and 198degc(wet).

Just as an FYI there are better fluids out there, but they cost significantly more (also these are all competition fluids and all DOT4)

Endless RF650 323 C 218 C (£40 per 0.5l bottle)
Motul RBF600 312 C 216 C (£15 per 0.5l bottle)
Motul RBF660 325 C 204 C (£20 per 0.5l bottle)
AP Super 600 310 C 210 C (£20 per 0.5l bottle)
Castrol SRF 310 C 270 C (£50 a litre bottle)

Whilst searching these prices I did just find some VERY well priced Gulf competition fluid. dry boiling point of 325degc and only £11 a bottle!
https://www.opieoils.co.uk/p-69356-gulf ... fluid.aspx

edit: just to add I've not tracked my BMW yet but on my clio 172 and my 350Z I was at the limits of the ATE TYP200 and starting to lose the brakes towards the end of long sessions (10 laps+), the 350Z even ended up with TYP200 in the clutch as the OE fluid boiled on track :lol:
The BMW being heavier and significantly more powerful will be even harder on the brakes so I would recommend TYP200 minimum tbh

Also worth looking into high temp pads if you haven't already? I swear by Carbon Lorraine. Literally don't fade ever but increase disc wear rates a lot
Huge thanks for explaining that, and yes you’re absolutely right about the bmw fluid being dot 4 not dot 5.1 as I thought!

I’ve heard lots of good things about carbon lorraine pads and am definitely considering changing pads for a more track focussed set.

Good to knownyor experience running your Clio and 350.

Lots to think about, thanks again mate 8)
'13 M135i standard.. and will remain so.. I promise... really.. will not modify... or abuse on track..
'91 R32 GTR... basically standard and unmolested... 497 @ rear hubs... never raced nor rallied : https://youtu.be/jhsX0elVG2k
+ some dullness

bentaylor
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Re: Git-r's road/track progress M135i

Post by bentaylor » Sun Apr 22, 2018 12:19 pm

Blind Pugh wrote:
Sat Apr 21, 2018 4:26 pm
bentaylor wrote:
Sat Apr 21, 2018 2:58 pm
FWIW most race fluids with high boiling points are DOT 4....

Just as an FYI there are better fluids out there, but they cost significantly more (also these are all competition fluids and all DOT4)

Endless RF650 323 C 218 C (£40 per 0.5l bottle)
Motul RBF600 312 C 216 C (£15 per 0.5l bottle)
Motul RBF660 325 C 204 C (£20 per 0.5l bottle)
AP Super 600 310 C 210 C (£20 per 0.5l bottle)
Castrol SRF 310 C 270 C (£50 a litre bottle)

Whilst searching these prices I did just find some VERY well priced Gulf competition fluid...
Yup - Opie are selling Castrol React SRF as well at very good price !!!

https://www.opieoils.co.uk/pv-962-castr ... 6kQAvD_BwE
Just went to buy this and it isn't SRF on offer. Just Castrol react. Checked the boiling points and that's only 280degc dry and 190degc wet - so not great.
Srf is still £50 a litre lol

I'm grabbing the gulf stuff to upgrade my clio before the next trackday and going to get some for the shelf ready to do the bmw in the future

bentaylor
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Re: Git-r's road/track progress M135i

Post by bentaylor » Sun Apr 22, 2018 12:19 pm

git-r2 wrote:
Sun Apr 22, 2018 10:54 am
bentaylor wrote:
Sat Apr 21, 2018 2:58 pm
Just on the brake fluid point.

Just because a brake fluid is rated as DOT 5.1 does NOT make it a good fluid, and especially does not make it a god fluid for on track. FWIW most race fluids with high boiling points are DOT 4....

which fluid did you use as I am struggling to find a BMW fluid that is DOT 5.1 rated?

The OE BMW fluid is DOT 4 and has a dry boiling point (no water contamination) of 230degc and a wet boiling point (water contamination) of 155degc.

I use ATE type200 (used to be called super blue or super gold) as its £15 a litre from Euro car parts, DOT 4 with boiling points of 280degc(dry) and 198degc(wet).

Just as an FYI there are better fluids out there, but they cost significantly more (also these are all competition fluids and all DOT4)

Endless RF650 323 C 218 C (£40 per 0.5l bottle)
Motul RBF600 312 C 216 C (£15 per 0.5l bottle)
Motul RBF660 325 C 204 C (£20 per 0.5l bottle)
AP Super 600 310 C 210 C (£20 per 0.5l bottle)
Castrol SRF 310 C 270 C (£50 a litre bottle)

Whilst searching these prices I did just find some VERY well priced Gulf competition fluid. dry boiling point of 325degc and only £11 a bottle!
https://www.opieoils.co.uk/p-69356-gulf ... fluid.aspx

edit: just to add I've not tracked my BMW yet but on my clio 172 and my 350Z I was at the limits of the ATE TYP200 and starting to lose the brakes towards the end of long sessions (10 laps+), the 350Z even ended up with TYP200 in the clutch as the OE fluid boiled on track :lol:
The BMW being heavier and significantly more powerful will be even harder on the brakes so I would recommend TYP200 minimum tbh

Also worth looking into high temp pads if you haven't already? I swear by Carbon Lorraine. Literally don't fade ever but increase disc wear rates a lot
Huge thanks for explaining that, and yes you’re absolutely right about the bmw fluid being dot 4 not dot 5.1 as I thought!

I’ve heard lots of good things about carbon lorraine pads and am definitely considering changing pads for a more track focussed set.

Good to knownyor experience running your Clio and 350.

Lots to think about, thanks again mate 8)
No problem at all! :)

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Re: Git-r's road/track progress M135i

Post by Blind Pugh » Mon Apr 23, 2018 10:35 am

bentaylor wrote:
Sun Apr 22, 2018 12:19 pm
Blind Pugh wrote:
Sat Apr 21, 2018 4:26 pm
bentaylor wrote:
Sat Apr 21, 2018 2:58 pm
FWIW most race fluids with high boiling points are DOT 4....

Just as an FYI there are better fluids out there, but they cost significantly more (also these are all competition fluids and all DOT4)

Endless RF650 323 C 218 C (£40 per 0.5l bottle)
Motul RBF600 312 C 216 C (£15 per 0.5l bottle)
Motul RBF660 325 C 204 C (£20 per 0.5l bottle)
AP Super 600 310 C 210 C (£20 per 0.5l bottle)
Castrol SRF 310 C 270 C (£50 a litre bottle)

Whilst searching these prices I did just find some VERY well priced Gulf competition fluid...
Yup - Opie are selling Castrol React SRF as well at very good price !!!

https://www.opieoils.co.uk/pv-962-castr ... 6kQAvD_BwE
Just went to buy this and it isn't SRF on offer. Just Castrol react. Checked the boiling points and that's only 280degc dry and 190degc wet - so not great.
Srf is still £50 a litre lol

I'm grabbing the gulf stuff to upgrade my clio before the next trackday and going to get some for the shelf ready to do the bmw in the future
Sorry - my mistake - different product and I didn’t read the small print !

Castrol React SRF whilst not cheap is probably the fit-and-forget BF of choice if wanting BF that can last longer and still perform, be it as for DD with odd TD’s with minimal intervention.
Fettled M135i EB AT - gone but not forgotten !
AW M2 DCT

godzilla
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Re: Git-r's road/track progress M135i

Post by godzilla » Tue Apr 24, 2018 9:22 pm

Blind Pugh wrote:
bentaylor wrote:
Sun Apr 22, 2018 12:19 pm
Blind Pugh wrote:
Sat Apr 21, 2018 4:26 pm
Yup - Opie are selling Castrol React SRF as well at very good price !!!

https://www.opieoils.co.uk/pv-962-castr ... 6kQAvD_BwE
Just went to buy this and it isn't SRF on offer. Just Castrol react. Checked the boiling points and that's only 280degc dry and 190degc wet - so not great.
Srf is still £50 a litre lol

I'm grabbing the gulf stuff to upgrade my clio before the next trackday and going to get some for the shelf ready to do the bmw in the future
Sorry - my mistake - different product and I didn’t read the small print !

Castrol React SRF whilst not cheap is probably the fit-and-forget BF of choice if wanting BF that can last longer and still perform, be it as for DD with odd TD’s with minimal intervention.
Is it less hygroscopic than normal SRF, which needed changing regularly?
Motul RB600 was good enough for my 1740kg 720hp GT-R at Spa.


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Re: Git-r's road/track progress M135i

Post by Blind Pugh » Tue Apr 24, 2018 9:30 pm

godzilla wrote:
Tue Apr 24, 2018 9:22 pm
Blind Pugh wrote:
bentaylor wrote:
Sun Apr 22, 2018 12:19 pm


Just went to buy this and it isn't SRF on offer. Just Castrol react. Checked the boiling points and that's only 280degc dry and 190degc wet - so not great.
Srf is still £50 a litre lol

I'm grabbing the gulf stuff to upgrade my clio before the next trackday and going to get some for the shelf ready to do the bmw in the future
Sorry - my mistake - different product and I didn’t read the small print !

Castrol React SRF whilst not cheap is probably the fit-and-forget BF of choice if wanting BF that can last longer and still perform, be it as for DD with odd TD’s with minimal intervention.
Is it less hygroscopic than normal SRF, which needed changing regularly?
Motul RB600 was good enough for my 1740kg 720hp GT-R at Spa.
Yes - has a far higher wet boiling point so can out-perform RBF, even when well saturated with water !!!
Fettled M135i EB AT - gone but not forgotten !
AW M2 DCT

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Re: Git-r's road/track progress M135i

Post by git-r2 » Wed Apr 25, 2018 12:49 pm

Thanks for the replies chaps, interesting educational reading :)

I think the garage I used for my 32 puts motul fluid in, maybe the same stuff as Dave mentions.

Speaking of the 32 it was incredible at Bedford on Monday :spotman:

I was braking much later and obviously going much faster than in the 1, made me realise how slowly I was driving the 1 because of the brakes.

The 32 clocked a 2:40 which makes it the second fastest lap of all time on Harry’s lap timer - yeeeeehaaaaaaaa!!!

There’s not much info to compare that time but I reckon if I could get one of my racer mates to drive it they’d knock at least a couple of seconds off!

Here’s the lap for anyone interested, had to swerve to avoid noise meters before anyone says how crap my lines were lol!

https://youtu.be/6ImYMgUExmY
'13 M135i standard.. and will remain so.. I promise... really.. will not modify... or abuse on track..
'91 R32 GTR... basically standard and unmolested... 497 @ rear hubs... never raced nor rallied : https://youtu.be/jhsX0elVG2k
+ some dullness

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Re: Git-r's road/track progress M135i

Post by Blind Pugh » Wed Apr 25, 2018 1:13 pm

git-r2 wrote:
Wed Apr 25, 2018 12:49 pm
Thanks for the replies chaps, interesting educational reading :)

I think the garage I used for my 32 puts motul fluid in, maybe the same stuff as Dave mentions.

Speaking of the 32 it was incredible at Bedford on Monday :spotman:

I was braking much later and obviously going much faster than in the 1, made me realise how slowly I was driving the 1 because of the brakes.

The 32 clocked a 2:40 which makes it the second fastest lap of all time on Harry’s lap timer - yeeeeehaaaaaaaa!!!

There’s not much info to compare that time but I reckon if I could get one of my racer mates to drive it they’d knock at least a couple of seconds off!

Here’s the lap for anyone interested, had to swerve to avoid noise meters before anyone says how crap my lines were lol!

https://youtu.be/6ImYMgUExmY
Sam - good work fella - how are the AD08R's holding out on yr Datsun ?
Fettled M135i EB AT - gone but not forgotten !
AW M2 DCT

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Re: Git-r's road/track progress M135i

Post by git-r2 » Wed Apr 25, 2018 1:19 pm

Cheers Dave, they’re barely legal (have done a lot of skids!) and could do with being changed but otherwise all good. Still in shape and giving ok grip, much better than rs-r etc :)
'13 M135i standard.. and will remain so.. I promise... really.. will not modify... or abuse on track..
'91 R32 GTR... basically standard and unmolested... 497 @ rear hubs... never raced nor rallied : https://youtu.be/jhsX0elVG2k
+ some dullness

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Re: Git-r's road/track progress M135i

Post by markhurley » Wed Apr 25, 2018 4:09 pm

git-r2 wrote:
Wed Apr 25, 2018 12:49 pm
Thanks for the replies chaps, interesting educational reading :)

I think the garage I used for my 32 puts motul fluid in, maybe the same stuff as Dave mentions.

Speaking of the 32 it was incredible at Bedford on Monday :spotman:

I was braking much later and obviously going much faster than in the 1, made me realise how slowly I was driving the 1 because of the brakes.

The 32 clocked a 2:40 which makes it the second fastest lap of all time on Harry’s lap timer - yeeeeehaaaaaaaa!!!

There’s not much info to compare that time but I reckon if I could get one of my racer mates to drive it they’d knock at least a couple of seconds off!

Here’s the lap for anyone interested, had to swerve to avoid noise meters before anyone says how crap my lines were lol!

https://youtu.be/6ImYMgUExmY
That looks fast mate ! Nice driving
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Re: Git-r's road/track progress M135i

Post by git-r2 » Thu Apr 26, 2018 12:59 pm

Thanks Mark! 8)
'13 M135i standard.. and will remain so.. I promise... really.. will not modify... or abuse on track..
'91 R32 GTR... basically standard and unmolested... 497 @ rear hubs... never raced nor rallied : https://youtu.be/jhsX0elVG2k
+ some dullness

git-r2
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Re: Git-r's road/track progress M135i

Post by git-r2 » Mon Jun 04, 2018 1:16 am

It’s been about a year since I got the car and I’m still loving it:)

I’ve sold my 32, over 12 years of ownership between 2 x R32 GTR’s.

With the cash from that I was considering upgrading the ugly 1 to an M4 comp and just having one car, it’s a pretty stupid idea as the 1 is lighter and obviously so much cheaper. The depreciation over a few years on the M4 would be more than the 1 cost!

So my plan is to modify the 1 to make it better on track and stop killing its tyres whilst trying to keep it ok as an only car.

Considering all sorts so please shout up with suggestions. Currently thinking h+r -15mm lowering springs, millway camber plates, -2.4 ish front, -2 rear, not sure about toe.

Thinking of maybe a sports cat, inter cooler and proper remap.

Hopefully that would give the right side of 400bhp with ridiculous torque :)

The main thing would be to stop it from eating its tyres, not sure if these mods would do that though...
'13 M135i standard.. and will remain so.. I promise... really.. will not modify... or abuse on track..
'91 R32 GTR... basically standard and unmolested... 497 @ rear hubs... never raced nor rallied : https://youtu.be/jhsX0elVG2k
+ some dullness

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Re: Git-r's road/track progress M135i

Post by marco_polo » Mon Jun 04, 2018 7:06 am

Wider rubber over-heats less easily, so I reckon your first job should be getting some 245's on the front and 255+ on the back. IE, new wheels.

Please can you update your signature to remind me what you've modified so far Sam?

Or, used 2014 M4? There are some proper low mileage bargains about now, which should have pretty good residuals.
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Re: Git-r's road/track progress M135i

Post by git-r2 » Mon Jun 04, 2018 9:28 am

marco_polo wrote:
Mon Jun 04, 2018 7:06 am
Wider rubber over-heats less easily, so I reckon your first job should be getting some 245's on the front and 255+ on the back. IE, new wheels.

Please can you update your signature to remind me what you've modified so far Sam?
Thanks Marco, yes I was thinking about new wheels although I’m not sure they’d make a difference to tyre wear as the current lean and lack of camber would mean it would still only corner on the outside edge of the tyre.

The only thing modified on the car so far is M4 LCA’s and racechip. Will get my signature updated pronto! :)

Yes was looking at the early M4’s, bargain pricing already but they’re so heavy. I’d just end up with the same tyre wearing issues I already have but on a heavier and more expensive car :(
'13 M135i standard.. and will remain so.. I promise... really.. will not modify... or abuse on track..
'91 R32 GTR... basically standard and unmolested... 497 @ rear hubs... never raced nor rallied : https://youtu.be/jhsX0elVG2k
+ some dullness

Blind Pugh
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Re: Git-r's road/track progress M135i

Post by Blind Pugh » Mon Jun 04, 2018 10:00 am

git-r2 wrote:
Mon Jun 04, 2018 1:16 am
It’s been about a year since I got the car and I’m still loving it:)

I’ve sold my 32, over 12 years of ownership between 2 x R32 GTR’s.

With the cash from that I was considering upgrading the ugly 1 to an M4 comp and just having one car, it’s a pretty stupid idea as the 1 is lighter and obviously so much cheaper. The depreciation over a few years on the M4 would be more than the 1 cost!

So my plan is to modify the 1 to make it better on track and stop killing its tyres whilst trying to keep it ok as an only car.

Considering all sorts so please shout up with suggestions. Currently thinking h+r -15mm lowering springs, millway camber plates, -2.4 ish front, -2 rear, not sure about toe.

Thinking of maybe a sports cat, inter cooler and proper remap.

Hopefully that would give the right side of 400bhp with ridiculous torque :)

The main thing would be to stop it from eating its tyres, not sure if these mods would do that though...
Good spring choice and perhaps pair them with shorter bump stops & B6 damptronic dampers to retain adaptive ?

I visited Ross walker at Ross Sport nr Ely in Cambs and he's running M2 in the Time Attackl series - he was complimentary abt Millway CP's on his m2.

If wishing to run -2.4deg upfront - as per MP's advice you will need to consider wider rubber to maintain decent contact patch for DD duties. I would aim at a square set 8.5" wide alloys with 255/35/18 all round that way you can swap wheels F&R + L&R to even out wear etc

Link below - AW m235i from USA owned by a guy called Rob Walker - he had F3x 441m 8.5" et47 with 255 all round with 5mm spacers & ~-2.5deg upfront IIRC

https://www.2addicts.com/forums/showpos ... stcount=69

Image
Image
Image

BTW there's chap on M2 FB grp [Ciaron Mckee works at Dyno Remaps] selling a near new F series N55 Wagner Comp evo2 FMIC for £600

BP
Fettled M135i EB AT - gone but not forgotten !
AW M2 DCT

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